Another Guides one with inappropriate girl guide leader and advisory committee member

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https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-15953295/transgender-burlesque-dancer-shaping-future-Girl-Guides-zealot.html

He resigned after the ban but has an advisory role on supporting trans girls and women. It’s not clear when the advisory role started.

72 new guiding badges, including kindness, laughter and calm spaces

Sounds utterly dire - talk about sexist stereotypes! The Scouts do cool stuff - DD went and they did archery - real bows and arrows.

Girl Guides seems to be rushing back to the 1950s with a side order of utter misogyny. At least people didn’t force boys into girls spaces in those days.

*they as in the group, not as a replacement for she.

Interesting how many trans identified male guide leaders get fast tracked into influential positions within girl guiding isn’t it..

My granddaughter is a rainbow, I’d love her to have at least one female only space as she grows up but if that’s girl guiding I’d rather it was dissolved than have her continue through the system as it is today as I wouldn’t trust them on any safeguarding aspects when I see how captured they are.

The whole trans farrago has made me realise that I often cede to men. Not unpleasant men, just men who have an opinion. It may be female socialisation, it's certainly wanting not to be in conflict all the time. I don't know what I would have done if I was in charge of something like girl guides and a 'transwomen' had turned up. Probably left. I really admire all the disagreeable clear thinkers who have stood up for women. It must have been incredibly hard to do.

I really don't think they're all like that. I'm sure I've seen posts on here from guide leaders saying their girls still camp, sail, hike, etc.

I’ve been involved in Guiding for a looong time, and I can assure you that Guides can and do all the same adventurous activities as Scouts. We hike, cook on wood fires, camp, do archery, go abseiling and much more. We also do sports, crafts, community stuff, a proper balanced program. Yes, some of it does have wish-washy names but the content is sound. If it wasn’t the 3 units in our area (age 7-18) wouldn’t be full with a waiting list.
The Guides and Rangers are off on a weeks camp soon- and I can assure you that the program is full of activity and adventure.
Oh, and this is the current cub home help badge: https://www.scouts.org.uk/cubs/activity-badges/home-help/

because it’s not just girls who learn practical stuff.

As for the trans stuff: ime most Guiders quietly got on with Guiding, some actively working to change things and most are relieved that HQ is now following the Supreme Court’s ruling, despite the protests of “Gate”.

I had a disagreement with my dad yesterday on road rules. I was driving as he’s no longer able. He gave his opinion as if it was entirely certain and more or less instructed me to do what he said. I disagreed and followed my own judgment. The disapproving silence afterwards was very unpleasant. When we arrived at our destination, I checked who was right on the internet. I was, in fact correct. On telling him this, there was no apology or concession, just more silence.

I’d say my dad was a pretty good dad really, but it hadn’t really struck me before, just how hard he made it for me to discuss anything where there was disagreement. I also thought about the fact that maybe my Mum should have stepped in, but didn’t.

I suspect it’s a common experience. I also don’t really argue with my son or men at work. A lifetime of giving way is hard to undo, but I am very conflict avoidant.

It was also instructive to me, arguing with men on Twitter, as I found it very easy to debate with them when there is no physical presence to worry about and I don’t have to put my woman’s voice against an over-confident male one.

The women who have stood up to these men in person are amazing. I think, if I had to argue this in my workplace, I could probably manage now, but only because I have an extremely good handle on the issues and am not afraid to use plain English. The latter is very empowering.

Vile, vile, vile

That’s good to hear - it’s a shame that the girls avoiding indoctrination is down to sensible guiders working against the wishes of Head Officer. So the groups with brainwashed leaders will have a poorer experience.

You're describing exactly what I meant!

Kindness… calm…. FML they are desperate for money now

because that’s all badges and the new uniform are. HQ hate when units go off and get their own badges made 🤭

I'm not sure exactly how much one's private life should have bearing on their career.

A few years ago, I knew of a female teacher who was reported to her school and I think the teaching board people because she had an identifiable profile on a fetish website (Fetlife). It was identifiable because she had face pictures up, but it didn't identify her as a teacher. The site isn't open, you have to be a member, and the person who "outed" her did so from a place of malice.

In this case, I think what she does privately is her business.

Another case I know of involved another type of professional involved with children having an OnlyFans. She is identifiable and her videos are "advertised" on social media to draw people to her OF. I think my opinion is that this isn't ok.

Breaks my heart

Self publishing on any website that is publicly accessible (ie through membership) is not private though.

You’re not UK based are you? US or CA?

Im in the UK. Both of these were in the UK as well.

I think that as sexual fetish is all about transgression and paraphilia, and paraphilias often cluster or escalate with a lack of boundaries, we should very much care that people like that are working with children.

There is absolutely no benefit for children having someone like that working with them and it increases the risk of significant detriment or harm. So how about we say NO to it being acceptable for teachers to publicly display their sexual fetishes in any way?

I’m quite stunned that this even needs saying but here we are.

and the person who "outed" her did so from a place of malice.

’a place of malice’? Or a strong and very appropriate feeling that this is not remotely suitable behaviour for someone working with children?

No, she was jealous that the person had started a relationship with her ex, knew she was on the website because they were all members, but knew that as a teacher, it might get her in trouble, so she contacted her workplace to report her. That is why it is malicious. The person reporting has no problem with fetishes and wouldn't think that someone should not work with the vulnerable simply due to being kinky, she was just angry and wanted to hurt her exes new partner and presumably her ex, too.

I think lots of people are into weird and wonderful things and manage not to let it influence their professional conduct. I do think one should be mindful when they work with children and said children could find them on the Internet indulging in their kink, but that's about it. I think we are allowed a (sex) life outside of work. Even an "extroverted" one.

I agree. Men parading their fetish shouldn't work with children in any way.

The person reporting has no problem with fetishes and wouldn't think that someone should not work with the vulnerable simply due to being kinky, she was just angry and wanted to hurt her exes new partner and presumably her ex, too.

Thats a worry. At least she ended up doing the right thing even if it was for questionable reasons.

You have switched to referring to the children she taught as ‘the vulnerable’. We need to remember that while children are indeed vulnerable, the fact that they are children should be foremost and the key driver of moral and ethical standards among the staff.

I think lots of people are into weird and wonderful things and manage not to let it influence their professional conduct. I do think one should be mindful when they work with children and said children could find them on the Internet indulging in their kink, but that's about it. I think we are allowed a (sex) life outside of work. Even an "extroverted" one.

This isn’t about ‘having a sex life’ - this is about indulging your transgressive sexual practices in the public sphere. Many people with fetishes need to push the boundaries to maintain a thrill. If those boundaries are weak, the behaviour can escalate.

As I said, there is precisely zero benefit to children to have a teacher with these faulty moral standards but it could introduce a significant risk. Why would you argue to introduce risk of sexual harm to children? Even if you think it is low, it is still increased risk over someone with normal morals and privacy boundaries.

Bring back the days when it was frowned upon for teachers to display their sexual fetishes in public and we didn’t get people defending it.

Absolutely.

Apparently this one was a woman (although possibly the male type) - which is also a serious concern.

It would be interesting to try the parent test - ask the parents if this teachers class how comfortable they are with their kids’ teacher displaying her bits (or questionable/disgusting sexual practices) on the internet for anyone with a credit card to view.

Yes. If a person requires to make their sex life public via the internet in any way, it really shows that they have low boundaries and are not modelling the healthy boundaries that children require.

It really isn’t hard to understand.

It’s quite scary that people will argue that it’s perfectly acceptable.

I’m a former GG myself and a youth group volunteer – I wholeheartedly appreciate the selfless dedication of the grassroots leaders you mention.

But I’m also a parent. A parent who lives close to Newark, where Sulley volunteered. And there is now no way in hell I’d let my kids join GG. And I suspect I’m not alone.

That they let a man with a predeliction for fetish gear and guns lead a girls’ group - and hold significant power there - despite all the warnings from senior women in the organisation- says it all. And instead of the leadership owning that scenario and apologising to parents and girls, they tried to shut it down. And that there are still so many women within GG protesting the exclusion of men like Sulley - I would be wrong as a parent to overlook that.

No organisation like that deserves a second chance with kids’ safety.

i can completely understand your position hholiday. I would just hate people to keep girls away from Guiding in general because of it... It's a very devolved set up -- so people should check out their local volunteers (who are often amazing feminists!), and decide based on those groups, not on a centralised policy, or on someone who volunteered in another county to them.